PleaseRobMe.com now considered harmful [Week in Bullshit Redux]

by Ben Smith on 26th February 2010

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Earlier this week we highlighted the confused rubbish that PleaseRobMe.com was spouting about privacy and location-based services such as FourSquare. The site was intended to ‘raise awareness’ the creators claimed…

I disagreed:

…they can’t have it both ways… There’s either a genuine problem – in which case their tool pinpoints those at risk. Or there’s not – in which case they’re just toying with fears over on-line privacy…

What’s happened tonight is the worse of both worlds… If the [updated: now confirmed] report below is correct, Foursquare user Carri Bugbee has been harassed by two morons whilst out to dinner…

Foursquare user Carri Bugbee reports harassment inspired by PleaseRobMe.com. She's right of course and finding someone at a restaurant they checked into isn't actually a privacy risk...

It’s unlikely that the people in question had any concern for Carri’s safety or privacy (and in-fact it was not at any risk as she herself points our), but PleaseRobMe.com’s irresponsible message that people who use these services are idiots creating ‘opportunities’ has inspired them to cause her distress.

The creators should acknowledge they haven’t identified a new privacy threat and close the site down before this type of incident is repeated. Their message (written and implied) has done harm now.

Source: Twitpic from Twitter user @jess3 via @payamd

Tagged as: FourSquare, harassment, pleaserobme

  • I saw a story on the local news and they were interviewing people who were 'outraged' and 'appalled' by PleaseRobMe.com .. They thought that something had to be done! Well here's a hint, stop posting that kind of information. I think the website does a great service in spotlighting people's lackadaisical attitude when it comes to posting personal information on the internet. Something is being done and it's being done by PleaseRobMe.com
  • But something isn't being done - the website is shit. I checked in at home (my most frequently checked-in location), with a 'home again' message, and it posted me on PRM.com - that's just stupid.
  • But why? No one - absolutely no one - has been robbed because of sharing their location from any of the research I've done. These morons are just using it as an excuse... They might as well have just worked their way down the listing in the phone book... it would have the same effect.
  • Abul
    In my opinion. PRM.com fails in the first instance. It assumes you are a single person living on your own and that just because you've check in somewhere publicly there isn't someone at your home - and it still doesn't give out your actual address.

    Taunting or abusing someone who checked in somewhere via 4Sq is plain wrong. Proves nothing, other than the fact their homewasn't burgled (in this instance) and idiots exist everywhere.
  • Yeah, I initially thought they were doing something clever, i.e. picking out people whose home location could be algorithmically determined with a high degree of confidence AND who were currently checking into somewhere other than that location. As it stands, it's entirely built on assumptions, without any clever code at all. I'm quite disappointed. :)

    I still think the site (or its concept) is a good discussion-starter for raising awareness of privacy issues, but as Ben says above their language is far too sure of itself, taking all of their unfounded assumptions as if they're solid facts and leveraging them into something fairly accusatory.
  • I have to agree with Dino that the PRM site isn't the problem - in fact you agreed with that much when you said "PRM.com was just an easy way to target her". The problem is with the kind of arsehole who thinks it's acceptable or amusing to harass anybody (about their privacy choices or any other subject) and we have laws for that kind of thing.

    The existence or non-existence of PRM would make no difference to this incident. The existence or non-existence of arsehole prank callers would.
  • I agree entirely on the general point. However, I think PRM's language and imagery encourages morons (like these ones) to view Foursquare users as justifiable targets by implying they deserve something bad to happen as a result of using the service. Not sure if incitement to harass people is a crime, but it's certainly irresponsible.
  • znmeb
    From the Twitter Rules: http://help.twitter.com/forums/26257/entries/18311

    "*Violence and Threats: You may not publish or post direct, specific threats of violence against others.

    "*Unlawful Use: You may not use our service for any unlawful purposes or for promotion of illegal activities. International users agree to comply with all local laws regarding online conduct and acceptable content."

    Now, whoever called Carri clearly committed a crime - can we trace that back to PleaseRobMe? I think Foursquare and Twitter have grounds for a major lawsuit here.
  • Allix
    Breaking agreed terms and conditions is not a crime. Not sure about intimidation, however.
  • Agreed. However, in some places recording a telephone call without both party's consent is a crime.
  • PleaseRoMe.com does (at least attempt to) say it doesn't intend for anyone to be burgled. However the individuals actual perpetrating this harassment have been quite open about it.

    I'm reluctant to get into legal issues here as we're more interested in the mobile / social aspects, but my personal view is that both parties have behaved irresponsibly.
  • Sam Garner
    I agree with Dino they shouldn't be showing their location to everyone, they should have known that something such as this would happen eventually. I for one wouldn't want people to know my exact location anyways.
  • "they should have known that something such as this would happen eventually"

    That just makes no sense whatsoever. Most people go to work every day, but they shouldn't have to expect to be prank-called there. Nor should people have to expect to be prank-called when they're at a bar, restaurant, friend's house, or any other location, regardless of whether that location is public knowledge or not.
  • Sam Garner
    @Ben Just because it says I'm coming from a certain doesn't make it true. How do you know I'm not using some other service to hide where I'm at, that is just ridiculous.

    @Denny It makes perfect sense, there is a difference between having information that is out there and actually advertising your where abouts every time you go to a certain location. Why would anyone with any common sense think that is a good idea.
  • "Just because it says I'm coming from a certain [?] doesn't make it true"

    Just because people check into somewhere on Foursquare doesn't make it true either - it's not actually a geolocation service, you can tell it you're miles away from where you are and it will believe you.

    Advertising your location is useful for various social reasons. It's not an invite to harassment, just as walking down the street isn't an invite to harassment.
  • Sam, fair point. I don't know for certain, but you are utilising a domestic internet service that identifies a specific location... However, most people don't take steps to obscure their location and that doesn't mean they should expect to be targeted and harassed.
  • Well Sam by posting here you've revealed exactly which town in the US you're currently in. The point is if we're going to have social conversations with on the web we'll inevitably need to reveal some information about ourselves, but that doesn't give anyone the right to harass you any more than if they saw you in person.

    Right now I'm in Twickenham, just outside London in the UK. How much greater risk am I or my home at by telling you that than I was a few minutes ago? None.
  • Dino Allsman
    pleaserobme is just pulling a search string from twitter. If you go to search.twitter.com and type in 4sq.com, you'll get the exact same results. That website isn't the problem. The problem is people who post their location nonstop to the public all day.
  • You're right about how it works but wrong about the rest... This lady decided to tweet her location - she hasn't complained about privacy. She complained about someone harassing her... just as she would as if they had done it in person. PRM.com was just an easy way to target her.

    Perhaps you'd like to be open and admit you were responsible rather than defending this pathetic behaviour - [link removed] ? What have you proved with this stunt... that you can abuse random women by phone? Sure, but you haven't validated PRM.com's point, because at no point was her home in any danger of being robbed.

    It's also interesting that you choose to lecture people on online privacy - using your name above and email address I was able to find [personal information]. By your rationale I could publish this or use it to harass you...

    Edit: Removed links as the people responsible don't deserve any more publicity.
  • Point of order; his email address isn't public information here. :)
  • It is to me as moderator of this site so I can look it up... but since you can now Google the post I've linked [now removed] you don't even need that to track down the info I listed now.
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